Cosmos

Welcome back to the show, my fellow extraordinary Americans. Today’s guest is Michelle Taylor. Michelle is a financial advisor with Gambin Financial Group, focusing on client experience and building individual holistic plans to empower clients. 

Michelle is also the founder of the Women and Wealth Initiative, a transformative platform empowering women to take control of their financial futures. With over a decade of experience in financial services, Michelle is committed to closing the wealth gap by providing financial education and a supportive community for women from all walks of life. 

From business owners preparing for exit strategies to stay-at-home moms and managing household budgets. Michelle’s initiative helps women define and achieve their version of financial success with confidence and clarity. She’s an extraordinary American, and I’m glad to have her on the show. Michelle, are you there?

Michelle

I’m here, yes. Thanks for having me.

Cosmos

Thank you for taking the time to do this podcast with us.

Michelle, so I know you’re into financial advising. Can you tell me in the audience a little bit more about yourself, your background, and how you got into this field?

Michelle

Wow. Well, it wasn’t on a straight line, that’s for sure. So, I grew up in an environment where I had a lot of exposure to entrepreneurs, which always intrigued me. I went to college, though, for something very different. I started in elementary education, pivoted, realized it wasn’t for me, and considered becoming an orthodontist again.

I was not meant to sit and look at people’s mouths all day, and in that journey, I realized I was searching for the autonomy that I believed that that profession would give me. So, I quickly decided that I was going to start my own business. My best friend Janine and I moved to Italy and lived there for a year, hoping to import goods back to the United States and have a retail brick-and-mortar. Unfortunately, that was during 2007 and 8. So, it wasn’t the best time to be importing goods into America because of the weakness of the dollar and the recession we were going through.

 Again, I pivoted importance and developed a product protecting designer shoes. That one was on the precipice of being held exclusively at Neiman Marcus. Unfortunately, my husband and I had some struggles starting our family. So, it became a question of whether I should focus on the business or pursue IVF to have my family, which I chose to do. 

So I don’t regret it, though, because it gave me a ton of experience and hands-on examples of how to start a business and then how to guide others. So, with all of this, I again realized what I am searching for is a career that I can have an impact on. I can change the way people think and feel about money, but I also want to be present in my own life with my family. And so one of my best friends was our financial advisor, and he said, why don’t you do what I do? You have two business degrees, and you can learn the rest. So that’s what I did, and we’re here today. I’ve been with his practice now for 10-plus years. And yeah, everything is just getting better and better each year.

Cosmos

Wow.

So, Michelle, there are a lot of questions to ask from here, but one of the questions I wanted to ask is: I know you believe in closing the wealth gap between the 1% and the 99%, and financial education is a key component of that. 

So, from your perspective, how do we go about closing the wealth gap, and what financial education do people need to start their businesses?

Michelle

The first thing I think that is critical is that we start talking about money. Somewhere along the way, it’s become a taboo topic, and I think that it just does a disservice, especially to women, because we’re even less ly to discuss money and finances with our friends. 

So I think understanding money, realizing where your shortcomings are, things that you don’t understand, finding mentors, and then raising your hand and asking the questions I think are critical to closing, that wage gap. I think that knowledge is power. And certainly, right now, we are in an environment where we have many resources, such as Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube. And I think it’s important for people to go down that rabbit hole, learn what they can, but then take those tidbits and then build out your board of advisors and make sure that the things you’re learning about are beneficial to implement in your life.

Cosmos

So, Michelle, let’s say somebody wants to do a 9 to 5 job, and they want to be you. They try their hand at entrepreneurship, but they don’t know where to go about doing so. How would they start their own business with all the risks regarding money and all that, as well as the limiting beliefs that come when you’re part of the nine to five this thing, you know?

Michelle

Yeah, that’s a great question. Because limiting mindset is something you said, limiting beliefs. And I think that the first place you start it is scary. I remember leaving my six-figure job and going into financial services, where I was the primary breadwinner and had a family to support. It was petrifying, and I think that that’s normal. 

So, I think it’s important to understand that anything worth doing will be a little scary. So, the first thing is to find people who can help with that limiting belief you’re dealing with. I’d say it is number one. Additionally, I think you’ve got to find something, a business you could envision doing for the next several years and what that will look like. Something I’ve talked about on my podcast is that I’m not a big fan of telling people to find what they’re passionate about and pursue that because just because you enjoy your work doesn’t mean it will lead to a life you enjoy. What I mean by that is if you don’t want to travel but pick a job requiring travel, you’ll have a job you love but a life you don’t. 

It’s important to define what life should look like for you and then find careers that fit that model. I applaud you if you want to be an entrepreneur because of your autonomy and being your boss. We have such an opportunity with the baby boomer generation retiring. There are more businesses than you can imagine where the founders have nobody to sell the business to or leave it to, so they’re just closing up shop. 

So, for somebody that’s a 9 to 5 and wants to get into the entrepreneurial space, I would encourage them to start looking through different business sites that list local businesses for sale and then see which one of those piques their interest and then find the right team of people to help you make that transition. Additionally, I think that setting yourself up with enough cash to feel assured that while you’re growing this business, you have enough that you can survive without it being profitable in year one is important.

Cosmos

Many people are either too cautious or go all in. Then, all of these factors come into play: financial management, employee management, and Everything else. And then it gets pretty; it gets a bit daunting.

But my question to you, Michelle, would be, during your time financially advising clients, what was your biggest revelation or lesson while advising people? And what did you learn?

Michelle

So, one of the biggest issues I see many Americans encounter is having too much cash and not putting it to work for them. So, especially women, we tend to be slightly more risk-averse. So, in many situations, we’re holding on to too much cash. And cash is the most expensive place to hold money because of inflation. 

So, I would say that that tends to be the biggest pitfall because if you want to grow wealth and be an architect of this beautiful life that you want to build, you need to have income streams working for you. And cash is never going to be the answer to that equation.

Cosmos

So I know, I know you mentioned that for women, they have to do things; they’re risk-averse. So my question to you is, I know there comes a time in a woman’s life where they have to choose between family and career, and then it can be their vision has to take a certain point and a lot of, and then that leads to them being risk-averse regarding money. 

So, from your perspective, how should a woman who wants to start a business manage those two priorities?

Michelle

So, it is common for women to choose between having a family or a business. But there are different scenarios, and choosing the right business would allow you to accomplish both. Again, it goes back to finding the right people to lean on, mentor you, give you confidence, and go out and bet on yourself. 

So for women in general, I mean the best thing they can do is prepare financially and then find a business that won’t require them to be absent from the home as much as others will. Again, it takes a lot of research, partnerships, and relationships, but it is doable and feasible. For example, many women can enter an already established business in a franchise model. It’s just now they’re running it. So it’s not as much of a financial risk sometimes, but there’s always an answer so that women don’t have to choose between being a mom, a wife, or an entrepreneur.

Cosmos

Yeah, I know it’s a decision that many women make. I know that I’ve talked to female entrepreneurs, and they had to face the question of where, on the one hand, they want to start a family.  When you have kids, it’s a big investment and takes up a lot of time. They also want to pursue their visions and dreams. And that creates quite a quandary, you know. So, from your own life, Michelle, what is it? How did you manage a family life and your business or business ventures? And how did you manage your time? So, if any women are watching this, they can learn.

Michelle

How to do so is hard, but I think that time is one commodity we all value. So, the most important thing is having a supportive spouse, especially if you’re a mom. That does make a big difference. My husband and I have kind of a reversal of traditional roles. He cooks dinner every night, allowing me to go out and do some of the things I need to do after work hours. He helps pick up the kids, takes them to baseball games, and does that. 

So I think having a support system, whether a spouse or a friend, a sister or a brother, will be important because it will give you the feeling of at least having a parachute of somebody who can help if you’re in a pinch. Secondly, I think that managing your calendar and your time is critical. Figuring out when you’re most energized. Some people love to get up early in the morning, have a couple of hours to themselves, and get in some work before the house wakes up. It’s the opposite for other people who want to do the same once everyone goes to bed. 

So I think figuring out when you’re the most productive and then building out your calendar and making time blocks that you hold sacred is the easiest way to stay true to that work-life balance. Of course, it’s not always perfect, but it will still be helpful when you commit to yourself on your calendar and keep those things sacred; it’s easier to say no to things you shouldn’t be doing.

Cosmos

Yeah.

Michelle, one thing I noticed about you is that you’re very disciplined with time because you have achieved success. I also think time management is a critical factor in business success. 

But Michelle, continuing on this question, from your perspective, what are women’s limiting beliefs when attaining entrepreneurship and success in business, and how do you think they should overcome that?

Michelle

It goes back to finding somebody you can relate to who’s already done it. So, especially for women, it’s a little bit trickier when we don’t have the same examples in, I guess, an abundance that men do. 

But find somebody who you think is successful. They don’t have to be in the same industry you’re in. But I think having a mentor you can ask questions of and get good feedback from when you attain success doesn’t matter what career you’re in. Some basic principles will translate over any career path. 

So, I think the only way to overcome your limiting beliefs is to find somebody who has forged the path ahead of you and have a good support system in place. And I know we all have baggage about money and upbringing. And that’s just something you’ve got to discuss and figure out why your relationship is how it is with money. But ultimately, I think being encouraged by another strong person, be it male or female, is the easiest way to push through your limiting beliefs.

Cosmos

So Michelle, earlier, we talked about how money is taboo to many people. There are a lot of people who have negative and positive feelings. So, from your perspective, why is it such a hard subject to talk about when it is so important in life and to your financial freedom?

Michelle

I don’t know. And I hope that that will change with conversations and the good work we can all do. Think of it this way: say that you and I are friends, and we’re sitting down at a happy hour with a few other colleagues, and somebody’s up for a job interview, and they’re saying, I don’t know how much I should ask for, what’s normal. How much more helpful would it be if you had a friend in the audience in your small audience to say, hey, I’m making X amount of dollars doing this. And I can tell you that what I know you should ask for this. 

We just have to talk about the conversations involving money consistently and disregard the taboo that comes with it. I think men are good at, I always say, having conversations at the golf course or over cigars and bourbons. You know, it’s just a commonplace conversation. 

But when you start talking to women about alternative investments and syndications, there’s so much women are qualified to invest in. Still, they’re not conversing with the people in their lives or surrounding themselves with the right people in the right rooms to know their options. We will only fix that by changing it within our circles and encouraging and empowering those in our circles to go out and do the same with their other relationships.

Cosmos

Yeah. I remember reading this book,  The Millionaire Mind, by T. Harv Ecker. And it just opened my mind up to how, on a subconscious level, we have all these beliefs about money, and it just.

Many of it is from childhood, and then we don’t even know about it. We’re just going on an auto, an automated robot, and we’re just going through our lives, and we don’t even know why we feel or think the way we do. It’s a fascinating topic because many of our beliefs are so embedded that we no longer know them.

Michelle

I know. And it. That is hard work. Right. I mean, getting into the entrepreneurial space, I feel, is almost easier than overcoming some of the limiting beliefs that we have from childhood. You know, I grew up where my dad was an entrepreneur. He was not the most disciplined with money, and it took him a long time to succeed. 

So I saw what he did, and. And I felt he had so much fun and could do whatever he wanted. But then I saw my mom, who was. I went back to work once my parents divorced, and she was sitting every Sunday balancing a checkbook at the dining room table and sacrificing to make sure I could attend dance classes. So how do we take the examples given to us and pull the important things from them to forge our path forward and try not to let them limit us? My mom was. She did not enjoy her work, and. But she taught me that I should go after the life I want and never look for somebody else to provide it to me. I think that’s very important. And I think that she had the discipline around money to ensure that no matter what, our needs were taken care of. On the other hand, my dad Showed me what entrepreneurship could provide. He almost showed me that paying attention to the small details will take your business from one level to the next and differentiate you from your competitors. 

So, I tried to take those two things because I didn’t have any financial guidance or education from my parents. They probably had many valuable things to add to my beliefs, but it was more of just observation.

Cosmos

Yeah. I mean, the how, often,   what we learn in childhood gets bettered for a long time. When we get into our 20s or start a business venture, we have half the battle, ultimately about our mindset, thoughts, and actions. And I would want the audience to know that because of the other. You have the tactics of business and all that, but it’s a combination of the internal and external worlds.

Michelle

Yeah. I mean, it’s just so important, and I think. I don’t know if you’re a parent, but that’s something that I always think about now with two young kids giving the discipline. What they do with their lives doesn’t matter, but basic financial understanding and acumen don’t matter. As parents, we all need to do a little better just to give the basics to our kids so that they aren’t doing the same things that we are because of a lack of opportunity or understanding.

Cosmos

Yeah. So, Michelle, on a national level, Right. You know, there’s a huge wealth gap in America right now. And the. No matter how hard we try to close it, the middle class disappears, and inflation is also part of it. It has a lot to do with it. So, from your perspective, what can we do as a nation to close the wealth gap on an individual level?

Michelle

So I think the important thing is truly understanding how you’re spending your money and operating in the amount of money you have now, not what you want or used to have. 

So I think it’s really important to understand how you’re spending to limit, you know, credit card debt because that is brutal. Have enough of a savings account that will get you through any kind of, you know, stormy months and then really start to observe and look at creating income streams. So that’s really. No, no one truly wealthy got there by saving their way there. I think you would agree with that. You know, you’re putting money in your savings account that will do anything for it. We need to understand how money can work for us out of our bank accounts. What does that mean? That means looking at investment accounts. Looking at real estate is an option if you don’t want to be in real estate and are looking at syndication. 

So for somebody that’s listening, that thinks, I would love to get into the real estate space, I don’t have enough money to do that on my own yet, they could look at something syndication where a lot of times that’s a $25,000 entry. You get involved in real estate without having to come up with this huge down payment. And the more you can get involved with those things and have your money-producing income coming back to you, the more you can snowball that and start something second. 

So I think it’s really important for people to understand your money has to work for you if you ever want to close that gap. Because, unfortunately, it’s just the way of the world. It takes money to make money, and you have to start somewhere. And I know with many people they hear, you know, high yield savings accounts and a Roth IRA; those are all lovely tools. 

But when discussing growing true wealth and shrinking that gap, you have to think a bit bigger and aim to have your money, not be your lazy asset.

Cosmos

No, Michelle, I couldn’t agree more. And I would also want to add that on a national and individual level, many people rack up credit card debt because they want to keep it up with the Jones. But when you combine credit card debt with inflation, that’s a disaster in the making. How do you get out of that in the short or long term? Because now you have to go to work, there’s interest on those credit cards, which are 20 and 30. So, we are the middle class, and the gap is getting wider and wider because the elite and the top people know how to do business. They understand how money works, whereas the rest do not know how the game is played.

Michelle

Social media has played a big part because we see everybody’s lives and are all the main characters in our stories. So when you see people doing things you want to do, I hate to say it, but oftentimes, people are spending money that they don’t have to go on that vacation because they know somebody who did it when they have no business doing it. 

So I think prioritizing, you know, I’ve seen this said by a few famous noteworthy people, but you have to be willing to sacrifice today to live the rest of your life differently than your peers will. And that’s so true. If you are disciplined and focused on, okay, I’m going to pay off my credit card debt, I’m going to be intentional with my spending, and I’m going to have those goals I’m chasing. Once you get into the habit and the cadence of doing that, it is the best feeling in the world, and you’ll never turn back. But you must start.

Cosmos

Michelle, I think that what we’re talking about right now is very similar to an addiction, but for what we talked about on social media. Because, yes, you see your friends and everybody else living the life. They’re showing the best pictures.

They’re not showing you their actual lives, but the pictures when they go on vacation. You compare your worst or average moments with the best parts of your life on social media. And then you want to rack up, and you end up racking up debt to go on those vacations to make a comparison. And it’s just a downward spiral, you know, and this is going, this is happening on a, not just a national level, on a global level.

Michelle

It is a big problem. And I, especially for the youth coming through it, it’s just that you don’t realize that. And especially because so much of what we see is paid partnerships, which is not real to space.

 So it’s just critical, I think, to have your own goal, set it, and remind yourself of it every day. And, you know, another very famous quote comparison is the Thief of Joy. Don’t worry about what everyone else is doing. Let’s worry about building your wealth, how, whatever that looks, one step at a time so that you can be the architect of the life you’ve always wanted. And that comes down to money conversations, spending less than you should, spending less than you can, being intentional, and putting your money to work for you.

Cosmos

So, Michelle, as a continuation of this, let’s say somebody’s watching this. They want to know how to achieve the American dream after they’ve Made the mistake of looking at social media, racking up credit card debt to pay for vacations, and then living up to the Jones thing. And now, they want to make a change and come to you for advice. What, what, how would you go about advising them to achieve the American dream?

Michelle

First, I would say to get crystal clear about your goals. What is the American dream to that person? And then let’s reverse engineer how we get there. Then, you have the plan after the plan. In my opinion, we have to tackle credit card debt first. Now, I also don’t believe in an or lifestyle. I believe in an. I say that because I’ll always have people say I want to pay off these credit card debts aggressively. I don’t worry about savings. That doesn’t always help. When an emergency arises, you don’t have savings to pay for it, so you’re returning to your credit cards. 

So I think it’s really important to, you know, feed both of those beasts, if you will. I think for credit cards, breaking everything down by what your balance is, what your minimum payment is, and what the interest rate is, and then coming up with a plan on snowballing those payments so that you are making progress. I think that’s so important for people to feel the progress. And then, once your debts are paid off, the world opens up. Now, we can get back to being a little more aggressive in putting money into a savings account to help you accomplish that goal. 

And, then, it’s just up to you to put your money to work for you. But credit card debt is brutal. I’ve been there. I remember being in college, making terrible money decisions, waking up in the middle of the night, panicked because I didn’t know what I was going to do. And it’s a valuable lesson if you can change your ways because it prevents you from falling back into that lifestyle. But I also think that people need to understand that building wealth is the best way to do that, and that is through debt. Use someone else’s money to go out and build something incredible. Credit card debts are not tied to an asset. So, you want to find debts tied to assets and shift your focus. But for credit card debts, we want to start there and wipe those out.

Cosmos

Michelle, it’s interesting because I talked with a few other successful entrepreneurs on this podcast. Then they talked about something called strategic debt for the acquiring Assets versus negative debt, which is credit card debt or things that just, you’re consumer debt, in which you’re just using it to get liabilities or just, get an iPhone or whatever. Strategic debt is how you truly become wealthy, where you utilize debt or other people’s money to get assets that increase in value over time, you know?

Michelle

Yeah, it’s really interesting. We talk a lot to our clients about positive arbitrage.

 So if you can borrow money from somebody at 4% but then take that money and make 10%, you’re winning. So, it’s all about identifying an opportunity and then figuring out how to leverage a loan or a home equity line. I mean, there are so many different ways that you can do it. You can use it through different types of life insurance. I mean, there’s a million ways to leverage assets. You can even have a line of credit against your investment account so that your money is, you’re spending a dollar one time, but it’s making money for you in multiple places that are the quickest magic bullet to building wealth.

Cosmos

So, Michelle, this is to help the audience better understand this term from your perspective. Ah, how would you define arbitrage, and what is a practical way of using arbitrage in somebody’s life to start making wealth?

Michelle

So I will. Let’s just use the example I briefly just touched on. Let’s say that you have an opportunity to buy an Airbnb. And if you can borrow money, and let’s say the rate is 4%, you still have that expense of 4%, but you’re going to take the money that you’re borrowing, and you’re going to invest it in this asset. Let’s say this time it’s an Airbnb. And if your returns on that investment are, let’s say, 10%, you’re still creating what we call positive arbitrage because the $1 you spent over here is allowing you to spend a dollar somewhere else. 

So you’re making money in two spots but only paying that 4% interest. So it’s just a way to constantly keep the flow in the triangle—the same thing with real estate. If you have a home that you have a ton of equity in, and if you take a HELOC out to buy another piece of real estate, the loan that you have through the HELOC is tied to an asset. 

So, it’s a healthy debt. It’s not using someone else’s money at this point. Technically, it’s tied to your home. But if you’re taking that to invest in another real estate holding that’s now going to create positive cash flow, you are winning the game. That’s positive arbitrage.

Cosmos

That is amazing, Michelle. And I’m glad you discussed it on the show because we are not taught this in school, college, or university. This is real financial education that people need to know to close the wealth gap.

 Because right now, there’s the top 1% that know how this is done, and then there’s the rest where they’re working the 9 to 5 job, and they’re racked up in credit card debt, mortgage payments, car payments, and all that stuff. This is the knowledge we need to know to get out now.

Michelle

Yeah. And I think, you know, so many people think I’m not ready to speak to somebody in the wealth management space. There are wealth managers for everybody at any stage in their careers or wealth building. 

So, I would challenge any of your listeners to find somebody they know and trust to help guide them in making the best decisions, even if they’re in their first jobs out of college or going back into the workforce. There’s never a reason not to work with a financial advisor or wealth manager to help guide you, hold you accountable, and make good decisions.

Cosmos

Totally. Michelle, the conversation we discussed regarding social media and its effect on keeping up with the Jones attitude is not discussed on a political level. The real discussion on how to close the good gap comes from understanding the psychology of our times and the societal and cultural norms. And this is why people are so much in debt: they compare themselves to the best, to the best version of other people’s lives, and they don’t realize that a lot of it is just an illusion and a facade, you know.

Michelle

Yeah, it’s fluff. It’s fluff. And that’s where if you turn down the noise of what’s happening and just focus on your big vision and have clear expectations, don’t let anything stop you or pull you off course, the small things you’re seeing on social media will suddenly become nonexistent because you are so focused on the result, whether buying your first house, buying a business, growing and scaling your business, or exiting a business. You won’t let small things you see somewhere else deter you. 

But you must have a crystal-clear vision of what it is for yourself because that’s where you get true buy-in.

Cosmos

No, totally. Michelle.

Michelle, I wanted to ask about it. I know you’re the founder of the Women and Wealth initiative. Can you tell the audience more about how you started it and what it’s about?

Michelle

I would love to. So we started. I started working with my very good friend, and I was just focused on wealth management. We predominantly work with business owners, and I have worked mostly with women because I’m a woman. And I found that even women you and I would deem very successful were still conversing where I have $300,000 in cash because I don’t know what to do with it. I’m maxing out my retirement accounts. What’s next? I had business owners that don’t have a piano.

So I saw a real opportunity, and that’s when Women and Wealth was founded and what it is. The primary mission of Women and Wealth is to change how women think and feel about money. So it is a membership platform that you can join and access all sorts of information, a library full of quick videos that explain topics and give you PDFs and templates on how to do this on your own. And then you also have the community aspect of it where you’re in, you know, you’re in this group where there are many other women on varying phases of their wealth journey. 

So whether you’re just starting or making seven figures, somebody in the community will be in the same stage of life. There’s. So that’s. In a nutshell, women and wealth are truly places where  —minded women can surround women. We’re having conversations, encouraging raising hands, and hopefully changing the landscape of true financial freedom and success for one female at a time.

Cosmos

That is amazing. Michelle and I would recommend any of my female listeners listen to this and check it out because I want everybody to attain financial freedom, regardless of where it comes from. Michelle, are there any other projects you’re working on that you want the audience to see?

Michelle

Yeah. So, I have a podcast called Talk Wealthy To Me, and the whole premise defines success. And I think that that’s another thing that’s so important. Again, going back to your point about social media, success isn’t always going to be flying in a private plane worldwide with your friends. Sarah Blakely. 

And many women see that kind of goal and think, if I don’t have that level of success, am I hustling hard enough? And I want to change the narrative on that. I think success can look different for all of us. And it’s all about ensuring that women have the resources to go after that version of success and evolve as they achieve it. But the Talk Wealthy to Me podcast, of course, I’d love to have any of your listeners listen in and give me other topics they’d like to hear about. And then Women and Wealth Co. That is awesome, Michelle.

Cosmos

Michelle, how can the audience connect with you and learn more about you and your work? If they want financial advice, how should they go about reaching you?

Michelle

They can reach me on the Women and Wealth Co website or Instagram, Women Core Ignore Wealth, and send me a message, and I’d be happy to talk to anyone.

Cosmos

That is amazing, Michelle. Michelle, I’m so grateful you took the time to come to this show and share your wisdom, especially about arbitrage and the current predicament of keeping up with Jones and social media. This is the conversation and dialogue we need to have nationally if we want to see any true change. I do hope that you come back to this podcast at a later time.

Michelle

I would love to come back, and I had so much fun talking to you today. Thanks for having me.

Cosmos

 I want to conclude this episode by letting my fellow extraordinary Americans know that, hey, look, there’s an extraordinary within every one of us. We must awaken it and unleash it. Until next time, bye for now.